What are good linux laptops for 2018?
I'm a developer who's getting a bit sick of the high price of apple laptops. Their hardware used to be more reliable and I could justify the price for a great trackpad (the best I've ever used honestly), good battery life and OSX. I realize though I spend most of my time in chrome and the terminal and in theory I could be spending a lot less for something almost as good. (Maybe something with a better keyboard?)
It's been years since I've looked at the PC ecosystem and I frankly it scares me. I have no idea what's a marker of quality and what I can trust.
What are good linux laptops for 2018?
I have a Dell XPS 15 and to be frank I would advise against it.
Good points:
- Strong hardware
- Looks nice
Bad points:
- M2 SSD requires changing some BIOS preferences to work on Linux
- Nvidia graphics card is a pain on Ubuntu. Do a Google search for nouveau.modeset
- The fans are on most of the time, even during idle. The machine isn't hot either - it just likes to run the fans
- The 1920x1080 screen isn't that great and a "4K" option is quite expensive
- The carbon-fibre looking plastic looks cheap and is a magnet for finger prints. It does not look good and is difficult to clean
- It's not a great machine to move about with. Mine weighs almost 2KG
- No Ethernet port unlike a T470. You need a USB adapter
My company-supplied Dell Latitude 7480, running Debian stable with its stock kernel:
> - M2 SSD requires changing some BIOS preferences to work on Linux
No BIOS fiddling, except for disabling Thunderbolt security for docking station to work (external monitor, network card, USB ports including keyboard, second sound card (though no volume control here)). But this is because Linux kernel doesn't support it yet.
Or maybe I did change its "RAID" to something that's not a lie, I don't really remember.
> - Nvidia graphics card is a pain on Ubuntu. Do a Google search for nouveau.modeset
Mine has Intel. I had no problems with running it.
> - The fans are on most of the time, even during idle. The machine isn't hot either - it just likes to run the fans
Quiet most of the time.
> - The 1920x1080 screen isn't that great and a "4K" option is quite expensive
1920x1080 gives way too small bitmap fonts on a 14" screen. I'd rather have 1280x800 or similar, but nobody ships that resolution anymore.
> - The carbon-fibre looking plastic looks cheap and is a magnet for finger prints. It does not look good and is difficult to clean
The plastic seems OK, but maybe I don't know what to look at.
> - It's not a great machine to move about with. Mine weighs almost 2KG
1.5kg
> - No Ethernet port unlike a T470. You need a USB adapter
Ethernet port present.
7480 looks like a much better Linux machine than the XPS I have. I should be switching to a ThinkPad next week!
I am not sure these points of yours are fully valid:
> M2 SSD requires changing some BIOS preferences to work on Linux
I never had to do this. That is weird.
> Nvidia graphics card is a pain on Ubuntu. Do a Google search for nouveau.modeset
This is true but it affects all computers Ubuntu with NVIDIA and Intel integrated graphics and is not unique to Dell laptops. This screws up our desktops at work that have integrated graphics.
> The fans are on most of the time, even during idle. The machine isn't hot either - it just likes to run the fans
I think you do not have the power mode drivers setup properly. Mine doesn't do that.
> No Ethernet port unlike a T470. You need a USB adapter
I use a USB-C docking station at my desks. Once you get a docking station that connects everything, including power via a single small USB-C you never go back. You just need a dongle when traveling.
> I use a USB-C docking station at my desks. Once you get a docking station that connects everything, including power via a single small USB-C you never go back. You just need a dongle when traveling.
Which dock do you use?
Currently the TB16, but I think the D6000 is likely just as good and smaller.
I find your result a bit surprising. Having the XPS 13 for work and these things are - besides the massive resolution for the comparably small screen - as painless as it gets in my experience.
The XPS 13 appears to be a much better choice than the XPS 15 - standard SSDs, integrated graphics, smaller and light(er).
The 15 I have has two fans: one I presume for the CPU and another for the Nvidia GPU (which I don't use). However, once both have started neither shut off until the machine is suspended. There is a suggestion that this is due to a firmware bug related to suspend/wake and it doesn't happen from cold boot. I haven't tested it out, will give it a go next week.
I've also been used to MacBooks and so the XPS does fall short somewhat in comparison - minor flexing and creaking and much less heat dissipated via the chassis (plastic vs aluminium). I have an Intel i7 in the XPS that appears to consume quite a lot of power. I'd much rather change it for a less powerful, more frugal i5 but alas it is too late.
From comment in this thread about a Lenovo: "I ended up installing NVidia's proprietary driver which let me disable the MX150 and use the Intel video card instead. Machine seems to run a little cooler since.". Might help if you don't need nVidia?
It's not a good laptop but for none of those reasons.
Thermals are shit. Even after a repaste, throttles a lot. Many people at my work have had hardware issues. My batteries are clean dead after a year of use.
Here's my experience. If you develop everything locally, get a decent laptop with Ubuntu or Windows 10 Pro.
Windows 10 Pro Edition comes with WSL, a Linux subsystem which is pretty decent for my deep learning implementation and small scale test. With Xming, I can do some visualization as well. There will be downsides. If you get a laptop that just comes with Ubuntu or any Linux distro, you are good to go.
If your development is cloud based, Google is push Chrome OS into a Linux friendly direction. Chromebooks are pretty good choices, price-wise, functionality-wise and portability-wise, you name it. At the time of writing (July 20s, 2018), Pixelbook and a few more Chromebooks receive the support of Linux container. More will be supported.
Am also evaluating migrating to chrome for all development. Currently using a re-purposed core-i5 work laptop, that boots lubuntu into ram. Runs vs code quite spiffily. As well as standard lxterm. And a complementary ubuntu micro instance that has been on forever on gcloud ;)
ChromeOS supports Linux via a custom container or VM. So you have access to all ChromeOS APIs. I assume virtualized graphics hardware will be accessible as well. Android Studio with device debugging bridge should also be available shortly. As will the ability to run most apk binaries.
Main concern is probably in choosing a 64-bit ARM based laptop. Such as the hexacore Samsung model. Eventually I can foresee running into a portability issue. Perhaps with a library dependency. Or digital content creation tools such as Blender or Adobe. Will always have a cloud instance or backup gaming laptop running Win10 to fall back on. But for mobile development and meetings in cafes, I think it will prove ideal.
In addition to some newer models supporting Linux containers, many older Intel-based chromebooks run smoothly using GalliumOS. It's a spin of Xubuntu designed specifically for chromebooks, and I've been using it for about 8 months now with zero issues.
If he owns an older compatible Macbook and want to get a taste for Chrome OS, He could try Cloudready from Neverware (Chromium OS), basically Chrome OS for other laptops.
https://www.neverware.com/#introtext-3
https://guide.neverware.com/supported-devices/
I haven't used it enough to know what its limits are but there's a lot to like with Windows Subsystem for Linux running either Ubuntu or Debian. Compared with macOS, it's current (apt-get to your heart's content), as opposed to macOS' terminal environment, which is hopelessly out of date. I really like what Microsoft is doing here.
What do you mean by macOS' terminal environment is hopelessly out of date?
Not OP, but guessing it's things like having Python 2 instead of Python 3 installed out of the box. It took them forever to update to Git version > 2.0.0 too.
I'm typing this on my Lenovo T480 running Ubuntu. Here is a little review I wrote after a couple of days with the machine:
https://reprep.io/writings/20180621_lenovo_t480_linux_review...
I ended up installing NVidia's proprietary driver which let me disable the MX150 and use the Intel video card instead. Machine seems to run a little cooler since.
I was pleasantly surprised that Ubuntu auto detected my network printer. It also played nice the first time I plugged into the RJ45 port.
I'm still underwhelmed by the audio quality of the built-in speakers. It's sufficient for video conferencing, but it's a little sad when playing music.
Another minor annoyance is that when restoring from suspend, the laptop briefly flashes the previous desktop before showing the lock screen.
I bought the new Dell XPS15 with 32GB RAM, 1TB SSD, and Nvidia GPU the week it was released, and straightaway installed Ubuntu 18.04. It is powerful enough to last me three years and the price was good.
I am mostly happy with it - superfast, great screen. The two problems I had were when installing the Nvidia drivers, plus the fans stay on more than I think they should.
Rather than waste hours trying to solve these, I have decided to wait patiently and see what the community and Nvidia come up with.
Would I recommend others to buy one? Yes, though perhaps wait a while if any of your key requirements are not yet fully supported.
I went from Latitude E7200 series to XPS15. I love it except for:
1. The webcam placement is terrible. If I'm taking notes during a call, everyone else gets a great shot of my fingernails.
2. I have to carry dongles for Ethernet and HDMI.
You can get a combined dongle like the Dell DA300 that combines Ethernet with VGA, HMDI, and DP (if you are doing customer presentations you need all three unfortunately.) That is what I use rather than carrying around a couple different dongles.
I love the Dell XPS 15 9570 with 32GB and a 1TB SSD. I have a docking station (TB16, although the D6000 looks okay too) and I run two 4K 32" monitors with a wireless keyboard from it as my work desktop.
It is thin, light, long battery and I feel like I am not making any performance sacrifices.
I would try Fedora 28, or if you are a bit more technical- Arch. I'm running Arch on a 13" and it works flawlessly. I've had a lot better experiences using Fedora when compared to Ubuntu.
If you want to use Arch but are not that hardcore-technical (command line installer etc.), try Antergos. It's like Arch ez-mode -- GUI installer, installs with a GUI of your choice (Gnome by default), uses all the Arch packages. I am running Antergos on a Lenovo Ideapad 720s and it's a pleasant experience.
Any thoughts on Manjaro vs. Antergos?
Haven't used Manjaro personally; from what I've read, Antergos is closer to actual Arch, where Manjaro is just based on Arch. This is a good summary article: https://freedompenguin.com/articles/opinion/manjaro-vs-anter...
Regarding the loud fan you should be able to run with NvidiaPrimus or Bumblebee - I provision laptops like this for my developers and switching off the Nvidia graphics to only use it when it's specifically requested really saves on battery. Also there is the TLP configuration which can extend your battery to a decent amount of time.
Pretty happy with my System76 Galago Pro with high-dpi display. It's small and light and has a really crisp screen.
That's my home machine. At work I have a 2015 MacBookPro. Comparing the two the only downside of the System76 is a trackpad about 70% as good and heat management design isn't so great so the fan spins up more and louder. (and the fat bezel around the screen, but whatever, the pixels that are there are good)
I put linux on my x1 carbon (gen 5) and it works well enough. Some notes, in no particular order:
* great keyboard
* kind of shit trackpad
* trackpoint is pretty nice at least
* hidpi is a pain in the ass to set up
..* looks great once you get it working
..* some apps like Zoom refuse to scale up, so the buttons are tiny
* light weight
* really long battery
kind of shit trackpad
Relevant, recent discussion on HN: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17547817
Setting the QT_SCALE_FACTOR=2 env var does the trick for Zoom on my end.
Thanks, I'll try this out next time I need to video call!
edit: good stuff, it works!
I can confirm all of these (didn't have any setup issues though since it's a pre-configured company laptop).
Overall, a really nice laptop (except wtf is that terrible trackpad doing in there?). Didn't find any compatibility problems except the fingerprint scanner. But I didn't try very hard.
Have you found a good way to adjust the trackpoint speed on your X1 Carbon? It's way too slow on my gen 4, and way too fast on my gen 6 (even after configuring it to max speed on the gen 4).
I'm not sure if what I did was the normal way to do it, but:
`xinput list` gave me my trackpoint device's name. Mine is "TPPS/2 Elan TrackPoint"
`xinput list-props "TPPS/2 Elan TrackPoint"` gives a list of properties you can change.
"libinput Accel Speed (302):" looked promising, so I changed it via:
`xinput set-prop "TPPS/2 Elan TrackPoint" 302 0.2` where 302 is the code given in parentheses above, and 0.2 is the speed.
Google Superfish. Seriously.
Just did it. It says the Thinkpad line was never affected. Seriously.
That is utterly irrelevant. You can't trust company that showed malicious intent or wanton disregard to not screw with other products.
Buy a T-series Thinkpad. They're sturdy, have really good Linux support, and even the older ones are extremely robust. Look for an older one, such as a T420; or, if you want a newer one, the T480. Those are going to have easily-replaceable memory, battery, and storage.
T series Thinkpads only come with U class processors. This is fine for many usages but depending on what you want you might need to go for the P-series.
T470P didn't, I'm typing this on a Core-i7-7700HQ w/32GB RAM and the 2560x1440@14" screen.
Cracking little machine for massively less than an Apple machine with a faster processor and until recently twice the max RAM the 'Pro' could have.
It looks like Lenovo did not make the T480P models. Hopefully they will still get to it. I am in a similar situation to the OP. Currently it looks like the only option is the Lenovo P51, however it has a numeric keypad on the keyboard.
The i7's available for the T480 are quite different to the ones in the T470 so perhaps they don't need to.
The i7-8550U benches about equal to my i7-7700HQ in real world use at half the TDP (so better battery life) though I'd be curious to see how it holds up under load for my workloads so perhaps they won't bother with a T480P, I've not seen any rumours so far.
I have a P50 running Arch Linux. I upgraded from a W520 and thought the keyboard would be a problem, but the keyboard is actually nice once you get used to it. Everything else works except for the fingerprint sensor and there's a project for that (https://github.com/nmikhailov/Validity90)
Truth to be told, T470p is weird beast because of it's incredible thicknes compared to non -p models. I think that most people who really need the power are better served by P series anyway.
Yes and no, it is much thicker than the regular T470's but it's still not thick by any measure I'd care about.
My criteria for too thick/heavy is "can I use it on my knee for a few hours without it feeling like someone parked a deathstar on my legs?" in that realm the T470P is just fine.
Aesthetically they are marmite though especially when put next to my GF's Asus Zenbook (One looks like it came from an advanced society, the other like it's used by the engineers of that advanced society).
The really strange one for me was that the T470P lacks a Thunderbolt 3 port despite the 470's having it.
Not a big issue for me because I drive a 4K display with DP just fine, I'd also have liked to have not gotten the 940MX, nothing wrong with it I just don't use it, the onboard intel graphics are absolutely fine for 99.9% of what I do.
Honestly I love the thing, it's been the least hassle, nicest laptop I've had since (ironically) my last Thinkpad around ~2003.
I have a x62 and it's an all around great Linux laptop for development (but I only code for fun, YMMV but I read good reviews using it in professional environment). I built it myself and it honestly was one of the funnest hands-on project I had in a while. Reminded the fun I had when I first learned how to built my own desktop.
I haven't tried them personally, but there are linux-specific vendors puri.sm and system 76.
A vote for Purism's Librem line. Not for all use cases, but great if the specs fit what you're looking for and your support of freedom and control makes it worth a bit of flexibility.
System76. I have a 2017 Oryx pro. Its fantastic. Not perfect, nothing is but as a developer it’s the best laptop I’ve owned. The specs trounce anything Apple.
System76 is also one of the only companies that sells machines that is committed to Open source, linux and hardware. They recently released their own Linux distro Pop_OS!. Its a really well put together Ubuntu based distro. Great design and continuity.
They recently opened a factory and are designing and building their machines in house. You get lifetime support.
I don’t work for them but I really can’t say enough nice things about them.
They are worth a look.
1.
Thank you for this. Looks very interesting !
I use a Thinkpad X1 Carbon as my daily driver with Ubuntu and it works well. My main advice is whatever laptop you choose, make sure there is good driver support (unless you really like tinkering).
Hands down: T,W,X,L-ThinkPad-Series from Lenovo are IMO still the sweet spot.
The keyboard is the best, the trackpad is ok but far away from macs, the battery life is meh but good enough with an extended battery.
But what I value most is: it's a sturdy thing. You will not break it as easily as other laptops. It will not get hot and burn your legs. Most models can be opened, cleaned and upgraded. Depends on the Model, but you can get ALL the ports you need! And, AND the freaking docking station. I have one at home and one at work and I just put the Laptop in the Docking station and I get all the ergonomics of a desktop Computer (because of external screen and so on). It's true, they are not what IBM used to build. But as I said IMO still the best for people who want to get stuff done and value hipness very little.
XPS are cool and all but for me it's more for people who value the hip parts of a mac, like shiny and cool, but fundamentally they only got the better looks.
I've been using an Dell XPS-13 with the Dell-provided Ubuntu for about three months and it's pretty nice. The trackpad is the best I've used on a Linux machine (still not as good as the Apple trackpads, but lots better than others I've used). Everything (sound, wireless, etc.) works across a system sleep. I still find the UI janky compared to MacOS or Windows, but it is bearable.
A year ago I tried setting up a vanilla XPS-15, wiping the Windows install and doing my own Ubuntu setup, and gave up hope after a couple of weeks that I'd be able to make the trackpad not suck, or for sleep to not screw the system to the point that it was easier just to shut the machine down every time instead of sleeping. That machine was also fairly heavy (normally I don't care much about that, but it was definitely noticeable).
I wrote a blog post about my (good) experiences with the Lenovo x220 and the more modern Lenovo X1C 4th Gen / 2016 edition here:
http://www.pixelmonkey.org/2017/09/01/lenovo-linux
Hope it helps.
Any of the Chromebooks that have gotten linux app support. I have an ASUS Flip and it's fantastic.
Apart the Thinkpad and the XPS lines already mentioned there (almost exclusively), don't put aside the laptop line of Xiaomi (specifically the Air and Pro models).
They are suprisingly well supported on linux, in addition to being very good all-around ultraportable at a small price.
I bought a refurbished Thinkpad X230 earlier this year and I'm very happy with it.
What tipped me over the edge is the repairability and modifiability of the laptops. After an ASUS laptop broke and I was only able to fix it because some random eBayer was selling a working keyboard, I swore off non-business laptops. There's a whole community of people who do nothing but mod Thinkpads, and companies that just refurbish ones (which have often been sitting in some office somewhere and are in great condition). Linux runs fantastically on it as well.
As for the trackpad...well, it's not great, but I use the trackpoint which I've always preferred. The keyboard on the other hand is amazing.
I recently set up a personal use Linux laptop. I picked the Lenovo Ideapad 720s. There was a good price and I really like lightweight and thin laptops. I set up Antergos on it and am a very happy user now. I run VS Code to work on side projects and work in both nodejs and php/apache and everything works flawlessly.
The setup itself involved a lot of gotchas, I wrote a post about it: https://medium.com/@bigilui/installing-antergos-linux-on-a-l... Hope it helps if you decide to do it.
*30 series Thinkpads (ivybridge) have the broadest support across all OSes (windows, Linux, BSDs, even some hackintoshes). If you don't want a new laptop, you can get one of those for cheap. General advice: Don't get anything with nvidia.
I'm quite happy running ubuntu on hp spectre x360 15 2017. Good build quality. I was surprised that the rotating touch screen and the tent/notepad modes work so well with ubuntu. Had to fiddle with bios during install to handle the SSD, ended up removing windows. The MX150 graphics card is not in use, but I guess if I were gaming I would find a way to use it. It's not a cheap option, but was way cheaper (roughly half the price) than the equivalent MBP.
T480s. No weird issues with the laptop itself. The Thunderbolt dock can be finnicky. It loses USB of the dock sometimes; that's about it. Kernel patches are underway I believe. Thing is an absolute joy under linux. Don't get me wrong, it excels in nothing. But it's 4 out of 5 for everything.
- Battery is fine
- Weight is fine
- Dimensions are fine
- You can add a ram stick for 24GB total (8GB is soldered on).
- Thunderbolt
- Fan management is fine.
- Thermals are almost fine.
- Exception: The speakers are embarrassingly bad.
For context, I came from a Macbook Air 13.
Another few weeks old Lenovo T480 user here.
What I like: 32GB RAM option. No dedicated GPU. Good trackpoint and great keyboard. Arch runs like a charm.
Note regarding the batteries: Internal and external battery, both easy to exchange. It however drains the most healthy battery first (down to 5%) before it starts draining the second one. I'd rather have it always drain the external battery first since that one is easier to replace.
They hardly get any credit, bit HP laptops are cheap, sturdy and play very well with Linux (or at least Ubuntu)
I just got a HP x360 15z, AMD Ryzen 7 (2700U), Vega 10 GPU, 16GB ram, 256gb SSD and its working great so far. You'll need ubuntu 18.10 or some other distro with kernel 4.16 or newer for GPU support. Wifi is in kernel 4.14 LTS. I've got gentoo running with sway and its quite swell.
I have a very minor cosmetic defect from manufacturing, but HP is allowing me to send it off for repair or get a complete replacement. I choose a repair since it can be done in under a week compared to 2-3 weeks lead time on a replacement.
I have always used Thinkpads without issues or regrets. Very reliable. I have a P70 now that's great.
Ever since I have worked with RedHat, I really like the standard-issue lenovo ThinkPad. I am writing this from Fedora linux on T470s.
But the best idea probably is to just get what your friends/coworkers are using :)
I currently have Fedora 28 installed on a T470 and a T480s and it’s pretty flawless. Not the sexiest laptops out there, but they seem pretty good for Linux.
I've been really happy with the Lenovo X260 and, were I in the market today, would get an X280.
I have a System76 Lemur and I love it.
I imagine the other models are also pretty good.
everybody is asking about linux laptops but i do really would like to switch to freebsd. are there any good laptops that work well with freebsd?
Not directly an answer, but you'll find a lot of stuff on the internet suggesting that intel integrated graphics don't work; as of freebsd 11.2, almost all of them do! Specifically, support was added for broadwell and newer, through drm-next-kmod.
How about Surface pro? If you are interested in AI, reading Math book many times, surface helps you a lot. I think its for Math/AI laptop